MR.ORLANDO AND I THINK THEY BOTH WERE THERE TOGETHER BUT THE ASIL WAS THE SAVANNA BULLY TYPE THAT STOMPED SNAKES AND MICE FOR LUNCH AND THE JUNGLE FOWL WAS A LIGHT FRAME FLYING TYPE OF BIRD THAT ATE SMALL INSECTS AND LIZARDS.
In talking with the Sandman, we came to the conclusion that a wild version of today's oriental most likely roamed the jungles and savannas from as far east as Malaysia and Vietnam and as far west as southern Pakistan. They were ground dwelling, strong, wild chickens that closely resembled the drawing above. I am sure they were commonplace in the jungles and savannas at the same time as the red and grey jungle fowl.
These were distinctly different types of fowl, both in their physical characteristics and traits, as well as their behavioral traits. I believe the wild version of today's orientals had behavioral traits that lent them to be more easily kept and domesticated. I believe their traits were more in line with the original fighting cocks.
There is evidence that the orientals carry red and grey jungle fowl genes. Whether this was a natural occurrence or an intentional crossing by man, I'm not sure of. If the wild oriental is the original fighting cock, then it would make no sense to me to have intentionally introduced such an inferior bloodline for fighting purposes as the red or grey jungle fowl.
Scientifically speaking as of today, there´s no evidence of a "different" kind of chicken ancestor for the oriental type bird ( for the zillion time...incorrectly called malay ), what studies have thrown is the evidence of the Red Jungle Fowl of the jungles of Vietnam, as the farthest ancestor of all chicken. A different "species" means different DNA and chromosomally composition, making the two kinds incompatible for mating and producing fertile offspring, and nothing farther away from reality in this case since the mating of the bankivoid x oriental type birds evidenced even more prolific and fertile offspring. So someting doesn´t match here, I reckon there are very deep differences in behavior and morphology between the two types but that doesn´t mean different proto ancestor or a different species... it is just the work of genetic variety and adaptation to different environments, as proved some hundred of years ago by Darwin. No one would say today that the ancestor of the chihuahua hairles dog is different of the San Bernard or the Chow Chow and so on.... what we see again is the work of the genetic variety inside a species allowing severe geno and phenotipic differences that can adjust to different environments and particular needs. Besides that, we must take into account the intervention of men in the whole equation with the use of cross breeding which adds a new scene to the normal course of nature.
the giantism and dwarfism genes or chromosomes for instance can make a huge difference in the outcome of a breed. We tend to think that only oriental type carries the gigant gent gene , but what about the bankivoid giants such as chochins and the such??, so selective breeding and cross breeding can do wonders in setting looks.
The Malay is a breed of chicken originating in Asia, most likely in northern Pakistan. These birds are cousins of Asil. It is unknown why they were called Malay, but perhaps because of a mistake by the former East India Company, when they introduced that exotic new breed around 1570. In Asia, the Malay chicken is usually found only in rural areas and villages. It is sometimes referred to as "kampung" chicken (kampung means "village" in Malay). In the Borneo region of Sabah, Sarawak and Brunei, the Malay chicken is called Sigun. In north West Pakistan these are called Sadalay meaning big docile or gentle giants. The Malay Chicken is sometimes used as fighting cocks in cockfighting.
Today, in the West the Malay is mainly kept for participation in poultry shows by breeders. It is considered a hard-feathered, gamefowl breed. The Malay has an upright stance, a well muscled form and a large skull with a cruel expression. Nowadays they are selected to be better egg-layers than in the 1970s with 70 to 120 eggs annually for a young hen and older hens laying only 30 to 55 eggs.
Pablo, for many years I have believed that the Asil is a completely different type bird from the bankiva. They are the same species, just like many other Phasianidae (genus Gallus) and would cross without a problem with many other of the same genus. Like I've said many times before, I do not believe that any of the jungle fowl either in Vietnam, Thailand, India or any other known wild jungle fowl are the proto ancestors of today's bankiva type or Asil type. While I do agree that they have been bred into both lines, either naturally or on purpose by man.
I can't remember the post where Willem referenced an oriental bloodline that did not contain bankiva genes. I believe it was somewhere in Indo-China. The article was a genetic study that found no wild jungle fowl genes in this oriental bloodline, which suggests a second line of domestic oriental birds having no bankiva genetics. If I'm not mistaken, maybe Willem can repost that study.
In any case, we have a long way to go to find the true origins of, not only the fighting cock, but also the domestic chicken. Here is a little more info for those who are interested.
Asils were first used for cock fighting and may be considered fighting cocks. Aseel is noted for its pugnacity. The chicks often fight when they are just a few weeks old and mature roosters will fight to the death. Hens can also be very aggressive towards each other.
Towards humans Asil are generally very tame and trusting. There are anecdotes where they have come to their keepers for other things than food, for example to get the keeper to open the door to the coop so they can get to roost.
The hens are not good layers, but are excellent sitters. Laying depends on the Asil variety, the small Asil are known to be very poor layers, sometimes laying just 6 eggs a year, whereas larger Asil can lay around 40 eggs a year.