I consider the HYDERABADI more of a type than a set family or strain. Birds that look like these in above posts can be found all thru central asia. I think we are walking on thin ice putting specific names and set characteristics on any game fowl type. I only called the fowl that i got in the UK from Naseem Hyderdads since they were of that type. I got some "Harrayana" from Melville, which were classic hyderbadi type, pumpkins, really striking birds, total dunghills. I sold CROSSES of the hyderbadis with the pakistani,atkinson,bombays, shamos, brasil and thais all over the states, some of these were kept as strains and resold under many imaginative labels. In the breeding of gamefowl it's a matter of personal choice what one wants, it's dictated by what sort of competition you face and ones personal sense of esthetics. Unfortunately today many gamefowl are kept as sentimental relics and the selection is based all too often on some idea of nostalgia rather than actual performance. As in so many things, "The more you learn, the less you realize you know" PS, I would "guess" that striking image from doceverett has some brasil in it's background, due to it's color. even as it's type is such a classic hyderbad. As I understand Dr Nassem has died, During the time of my visit he was getting fowl in from everywhere, He had just gotten some big Okinawas at the time, and had a managerie of all sorts of birds. His indiscrimate breeding encourged me to dispose of all but three older birds that came direct from pakistan that the doctor had imported.
PSS, The term KATCH and Baluchistan rings a bell, I imported a classic brown red 6 lb asil that resembeled more the reza type than the hyderbads, which Naseem called a Katch or "quetta" from baluchistan... this did not prove game and was shortly dispatched. He told me the origin of his hyderbadi types were from Mohammad Mobin of Lahore Pakistan. I imported 7 birds from Naseem in 1984. Eventually only 3 of these were used, the mother,son hyderbadi greys and one big cream white "Punjabi", this later cock died that year, but I did get chicks from him and a blue brasil hen, which turned out very well. as mentioned earlier, of the 20 eggs I brought home 19 hatched, after several of these proved to be dunghill, we dispatched them all.
There is also a city named Hyderabad in Pakistan, in the Sindh province. But generally the Hyderabadi Asil mentioned in gamefowl literature refer to the large type. Very famous Hyderabadi were bred in nearby Golconda (Golkonda) which was the capital of the medieval Muslim sultanate of the Qutb Shahi dynasty (1518–1687). Even a Nepali king named Rana Bahadur Shah (1775-1806) ordered cocks from Hyderabad (citation)......”King Rana Bahadur Shah, in his letter to Deenanth Upadhya, had ordered for the cocks of Hyderabad”…..(end of quote). Source of this info is a publication titled “Social history of Nepal” (1993). So one can imagine that if a king living up in the Himalaya mountains ordered Asils from the south of India, the reputation of these Hyderabai Asils must have been more then excellent.
Post last edited May 10th 2018
The beginning of wisdom is to call things by their right names
I wonder which would be closest to what curt imported , the Hyderbads of Dr. dave or the hyderbad influences Pakis of curt....I know the actual Hyderbad blood is minute in both lines but wonder which carries more of the real stuff
Regarding the Hyderbadi asils that Dr Dave and I have had... They are the same. coming as stated earlier from Dr Naseem of Birmingham england in 1984, We both crossed these into Japs,Thais,Brasilians and Asils and these in turn were distributed all over with a variety of results. Eventually I settled on ONE infusion from ONE old hen, a grey that came direct from Pakistan via Naseem. Crossed into the Reynolds Pakistani. While visiting Les Melville about this time, early 80's, Melville gifted me with what looked to be classic pumpkin colored hyderbadis, which he told me were a direct gift from the govenor of Haryana state..? My first and ONLY cross into the pakistanis yeilded 2 gorgeous pumpkin stags that showed absolutely zero courage. I never sold any or kept any of this line. The Hyderbadis seem to be a very dominant line at least in color, as even today with a very small % of Hyderbadi the pumpkin color dominates. Oddly the grey phase dissapeared. As stated earlier I brought home eggs from Dr Naseem, but these never proved worthy, in fact it turned Dave totally off. Thats why I only carried on with the ONE original hen, which eventrually became the nexus of all the hyderbadis from Dave and myself. The original import was 7 birds. Dr Naseem said they originated in Lahore pakistan, mentioning a man named Mohammad Mobin, which may or may not be the actual breeder of these fowl. Today Dr Dave continues with his small banty type orientals and the hyderbadi colors still exist in his fowl, even as they may only carry a TINY fraction of that blood. My Pakistani today still carry a small fraction of this blood, but overall they are my BLEND that is predominantly Reynolds Pakistani. I added some Atkinson via Andy Hightower years ago and more recently some Atkinson via the Bill Ross line. The original Pakistani's I got from Manuel Reynolds were his BLEND of several Asil strains. So those looking for PURITY, best of luck.. Brady; I never sent any PURE or Straight Hyderbadis out, were you refering to the Harayanas that Dennis Wells had? Which I think were the same as Melvilles? About 10 years ago Dave got some Hyderbadis from Larry Lingerfelt, these were very uniform smaller more REZA type, we assumed these were bred into a strain from some of the crosses we sent out involving the Pakistani,Rampuri,Bombay and Murghs. Regardless, these were top notch fowl, whoever created them..
The ones I have are nothing like you described Brady, in fact the polar opposite, quick highly aggro birds, but babies in hand....Thick and mud with shanks like broom sticks, I got a dark leg pullet this season that is very Murgh like, I can only assume she is showing Rampuri, the ‘golden laced’ color is extremely dominant for every 2 pullets one will be this color even crossed on Black Rajahs the results are the same
Jesse, that cock was largely the Hyderbadi strain I mentioned from larry Lingerfelt. He is an excellent bird and beautifully laced. he is in safe keping, he was too big for dave! There is no point in calling these birds hyderbadis anymore, unless we think of color more than a type represents a strain. We have these butterscotch or palimino colors coming from the line bred pumpkins, some show more gold in the saddles, sometimes the hens are almost white. So I call these the Golden Pakistani's.. as opposed to the pumpkin pakistanis or the classic br reds.. It's all the same bloodlines. all things being equal it's nice to have eye candy AND the bottom line..
I see Curt, I agree, they are not Hyderbads any longer, but a hard habit To break,
I have been referring to them as Plainly Reza Asil as of lately, to try and break the habit.
Your Hyderbad influenced Hanson asils are top notch, and some of my favorite Asil to admire,
I commend you on your efforts and selection process,
During my visit I was ain’t Awe at the quality they exhibited,
And the uniformity, even in the different stages of the Atkinson infusion,
You showed me a few things that really stood out, and I’ve put that to use myself with my own birds